I don't relate religion and vegetarianism, as I don't believe non-humans have souls. I don't believe there is a kitty cat heaven or anything like that. If I choose not to eat meat, it has nothing to do with my religion.

Posted by: Joey Q. | July 10, 2008 04:33 PM

i don't know that lack of a soul excuses you from damaging something. There's intrinsic value to things, Joey. For example, I don't have a religious system which acknowledges any such thing as a soul, but I still find choosing to kill without need to be unnecessarily cruel.

Posted by: Sinon Robert | July 10, 2008 05:01 PM

As a Catholic, I am thrilled to read of this. This definitely needs to continue.

How nice for a Garden of Eden to become a reality.

GO VEGAN!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: Ana | July 10, 2008 05:17 PM

If God truly wanted all animals (humans included) to be peacemakers...then he would have made everyone vegans. Why did this not happen, I ask?

Posted by: S.Q. | July 10, 2008 06:23 PM

"I always found it a bit insincere that people were comfortable following a faith that preaches love and understanding yet don't blink when eating those who need just that."

Funny, I always found it a bit insincere that people were comfortable following an organization that preaches animal rights yet don't blink when eating products that violate them.

Vegetarians violate animal rights with every bite of egg and cheese. Why do advocates of "the" animal rights organization keep celebrating animal exploitation in word and deed?

Really respect animal rights: don't go vegetarian, don't go "veg," go VEGAN.

Posted by: Ryan | July 10, 2008 07:02 PM

I am a Catholic as well! Of course there is a small group of Catholics that are vegitarian. There are vegitarians in all groups. However, Don't think for one second that this is the doctrine of the Catholic religion! I've been to more Catholic picnicks in my life than you can shake a stick at. Believe me when I tell you these were far from vegitarian.
I will respect my fellow Catholics in their choices to be vegitarian. However, this is the most important part PETA needs to listen to. Catholics will always concentrate on helping human sufering first! Animals would be far down the list!

Posted by: Kurt K | July 10, 2008 07:38 PM

I'm sorry if this goes against your personal beliefs (kind of), but as you express you're a Christian I just figured you would live by the book.

Genesis 9:3 states:

Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.

Proverbs 12:10 states:

A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.

God says treat your animals good, but also says that after the fall of man they were to be food as well. Its a pretty simple concept. So please, if you're going to try and convince people of your views by associating them with religion please make sure they parallel the scriptures from your beliefs.

Posted by: Ty | July 10, 2008 10:49 PM

Hello all.. I have seen pigs slaughtered in my neighbor's yard.I am not offending other ethnic groups but with this I AM! I live in close quarters (a neighborhood not even a farm!these people slaughtered a pig in their back yard a few years ago, and my authorities did NOTHING and Said i could not do anything.. how bout that?!! not for that and no pun intended and if that didn't get your goat they bought in some goats tonite had a fiesta or whatever YOU or I would choose to call it (I call it inhumane nevertheless they began the same ritual they did when the slaughtering of the pigs began, i called local authorities, and they said someone will call me back, and as usual nothing was done, and no one called me. I am going to move out of my home.. what a shame I have lived her most of my 56 years, and I am moving away from THEM. just Food for thought gang this is what goes on in my town of Statesville North carolina!!! God Bless you for this site

Posted by: jean volk | July 10, 2008 10:56 PM

Very interesting article. Good point.

Posted by: Darlene | July 10, 2008 11:47 PM

I'm a Scientologist and I think that this is wonderful what the Catholic Worker has said. I will definitely be spreading this article around.

Thanks for letting us know.

Posted by: Curtis | July 11, 2008 12:22 AM

Precisely! If animals don't have "souls", we should then feel much more compassion for them, because this life is all they have!
I am a Catholic, and I have to say that this has been one of the most inspirational articles I have read. It really hits home for me. I always try to remember that His eye is on the sparrow. His eye is on the chicken, too.

Posted by: Daniella | July 11, 2008 08:41 AM

I am Seventh Day Adventist and they don't preach vegetarianism but I have met many who are vegetarians or eat meat in moderation. I didn't become vegetarian because of my religion because I was raised Baptist and ate meat for 26 years (well ok, not when i was 1 year old, but you get the point).

Not every Catholic is vegetarian (of course you knew that) and I highly doubt they would be. I have yet to hear about any religion that preaches against eating meat. The Catholic religion is not my favorite religion. I have heard more bad than good about them. My husband was Catholic for many many years before he converted to Adventism and "excommunicated" himself from the church.

You can preach peace and still eat meat. Not everyone equates peace the way you and P.E.T.A. does. When most people think "peace" they are thinking in terms of other humans. Animals are not the first thing that comes to their minds. Although it is a nice thought to live in harmony with animals- this will not be happening until
Jesus returns.

From what I have read- God gave us rule over the animals. People have their right to choose. I simply don't eat meat because of how animals suffer before they are slaughtered. But if it was proven that all animal farms and factories treated animals humanely before being killed- yes I would still eat meat. But I am choosing to forgo eating meat because of the cruelty animals face just to become our food.

Posted by: brandie r. | July 11, 2008 09:52 AM

Oh YAWN, here we go again with the “religion” and “no soul” excuses. While the underlying principal of “religion” is to treat all beings with respect is commendable, they're so rife with hypocrisy it makes me sick. Human beings are very good at coming up with religious excuses to condone their or someone else's actions. ALL living beings have souls, including “animals”. It seems most people don't have the intellectual capacity to figure this out. While I'll agree with Joey Q that there is more than likely no separate cat, dog, rat, fish, cow, chicken heaven. I do believe that ALL sentient beings, including “animals” all go to where ever we go when we pass on.

Posted by: CRaig | July 11, 2008 10:15 AM

This article is great! I am a Christian and my faith in God and love and respect for his creation is the main reason I am a vegan. Every time I look at an animal I am able to see how wonderfully and beautifully they are made and I know in my heart that God did not intend for factory farms, animal abuse and animal exploitation when he created any living being. As a Christian, there is simply no way to justify what is being done to animals for food and clothing with the alternatives that are available.

Posted by: KJ | July 11, 2008 10:29 AM

No souls? Who says an animal doesn't have a soul? Believe me...I'm a Catholic and MY God wouldn't think of a heaven without these beautiful creatures. All creatures big and small...God created and loves them all!

Posted by: Sharon | July 11, 2008 10:34 AM

I am an atheist and I am one of the most compassionate people i know. I go above and beyond for people and animals. Let's not be too quick to praise the catholics... dont get me wrong the veg thing is awesome, but let us remember the lying, cheating, stealing and sexual abuse at their hand. Its history and still happening today and they have yet to own up to a lot of that.

It's really frustrating how self richeous people are about their religion.... leave religion out of it PETA

Posted by: maeghan | July 11, 2008 10:36 AM

I grew up a not so strict Catholic and with a dad being an avid hunter. My mom did not cook "wild game" for us at dinner time, it was mostly for my dad and his friends. "Meat" was "traditional" at every meal. I don't know if it was how cow and pig was cooked but I couldn't stomach it from the begining. My dog got most of them (it) when no one was looking. I have to tell you it wasn't religion that inspired me to be veg. It was the love I have for animals and eating them just wasn't an option for me and still IS NOT.

Posted by: Carla | July 11, 2008 10:52 AM

I always find it interesting and strange when people say something like "I don't believe animals have souls." Everyone has their own "beliefs" of course, however beliefs are simply "guesses" at what is real and true. If we are honest with ourselves, we must say that in reality NONE OF US KNOWS ANYTHING FOR CERTAIN about such things. We do not know if animals have souls or not. If you have ever had a pet and been with it when it is euthanized, you may feel that his/her soul has left the body. This has been my experience when I had a beloved pet put to sleep for an incurable illness. Did he have a soul--I have no idea. I "believe" he did but none of us knows for sure anything within the realm of the spiritual. Who says humans are the greatest thing on earth? I don't agree. Animals would prosper and thrive without humans on the planet. But, take animals away from humans and we would not fare so well. Who really needs who and who is the real "intelligent" species?

FYI: I'm a newly confirmed Catholic. :o)

Posted by: Maggie Moo | July 11, 2008 10:53 AM

KJ - What do you mean there is no justifiation? It was okay to eat meat 200 hundred years ago, but now it is not because we can grow more corn? That is not very convincing. Animals are either here to eat or not. They were not here to eat for awhile until technology made it possible to eat other crap! What makes animals more special now?

Posted by: Kurt K | July 11, 2008 11:02 AM

Maeghan,
I must be easy for you critisize my religion when you don't believe in a higher power! The Catholic religion does far more good than you could ever comprehend.
I am ashamed that there are preists who have done such things and I pray for the victims of sexual abuse. There are over a billion Catholics in the world, they can't all be saints.

Posted by: Kurt K | July 11, 2008 12:19 PM

I am deeply religious, but don't follow organized religion. I see a lot of people claim that we were given 'dominion' over animals, etc., and that gives us the right to deprive them of their lives for even the most trivial human desire.

I interpret this in another way: we have the power to do anything we choose, not only to animals but to our fellow humans. We have the responsibility to use this power compassionately, and not to harm or kill until we are given no choice.

Even as little as 200 year ago, in many cases eating meat was not a choice, it was a requirement for survival.

The human race is accelerating, evolving, at an unprecedented rate. Now, not only is it possible for most of us to live well without killing animals, it's actually the best option--for countless reasons that I don't care to explain here (see goveg.com). If I can easily minimize the pain and death caused by my time on earth, I will.

The beauty of this life is that each of us has the opportunity to choose, and each moment offers thousands of choices. You can choose to take drugs, or go on a binge-drinking spree, or jump off a bridge. You can choose to write a novel, or donate to charity, or take a stand for something you believe in. Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. As humans, this is our burden. I try to remember that with every choice I make...

-Yuka

Posted by: Rachel A | July 11, 2008 01:03 PM

God gave us the responsiblity of taking care of his creation (including animals), and yes, He did say would could eat meat, but it came at a price, we would no longer live in harmony with them (Gen 9:1-4).
Since we have the responsibilty of taking care of the earth and all that inhabits it, we should do something to prevent factory farming, abuse of animals, and the like. Knowing where meat comes and then not supporting that process, in my opinion, is just being a good steward. Also, knowing the strain it puts on the planet to support the demand for meat and doing what YOU can to help is good stewardship.
God does talk about animals in the afterlife. Isaiah 65:17-25 is a good example of how animals fit into God's ideal picture of how things should be.
Also, God also wants us to take care of our "temples", and it is widely known that a meat-based diet is just not healthy.

Posted by: sjm | July 11, 2008 02:10 PM

BRANDIE R!!

You said,

"I am Seventh Day Adventist and they don't preach vegetarianism"

YES, THIS CHRISTIAN RELIGION DOES!

Your own religion's (Seventh Day Adventism) cofounder, Ellen G. White, a woman way ahead of her time, stated the following. She said not an ounce of animal flesh should enter our stomachs. These are some of her quotes:

God gave our first parents the food He designed that the race should eat. It was contrary to His plan to have the life of any creature taken. There was to be no death in Eden. The fruit of the trees in the garden was the food man's wants required. - 1864
The diet of animals is vegetables and grains. Must the vegetables be animalized, must they be incorporated into the system of animals, before we get them? Must we obtain our vegetable diet by eating the flesh of dead creatures? God provided fruit in its natural state for our first parents. He gave to Adam charge over the garden, to dress it, and to care for it, saying, "To you it shall be for food." One animal was not to destroy another animal for food. - 1896
Let our ministers and canvassers step under the banners of strict temperance. Never be ashamed to say, "No thank you; I do not eat meat. I have conscientious scruples against eating the flesh of dead animals." - 1901
Animals are becoming more diseased and it will not be long until animal food will be discarded by many besides Seventh-day Adventists. Foods that are healthful and life sustaining are to be prepared, so that men and women will not need to eat meat. – 1902
Vegetables, fruits, and grains should compose our diet. Not an ounce of flesh meat should enter our stomachs. The eating of flesh is unnatural. We are to return to God's original purpose in the creation of man. - 1903
The moral evils of a flesh diet are not less marked than are the physical ills. Flesh food is injurious to health, and whatever affects the body has a corresponding effect on the mind and the soul. Think of the cruelty to animals meat-eating involves, and its effect on those who inflict and those who behold it. How it destroys the tenderness with which we should regard those creatures of God! - 1905
Animals are often transported long distances and subjected to great suffering in reaching a market. Taken from the green pastures and traveling for weary miles over the hot, dusty roads, or crowded into filthy cars, feverish and exhausted, often for many hours deprived food and water, the poor creatures are driven to their death, that human beings may feast on carcasses. - 1905
It is a mistake to suppose that muscular strength depends on the use of animal food. The needs of the system can be better supplied, and more vigorous health can be enjoyed, without its use. The grains, with fruits, nuts, and vegetables, contain all the nutritive properties necessary to make good blood. These elements are not so well or so fully supplied by a flesh diet. Had the use of flesh been essential to health and strength, animal food would have been included in the diet appointed man in the beginning. - 1905
Those who eat flesh are but eating grains and vegetables at second hand; for the animal receives from these things the nutrition that produces growth. The life that was in the grains and the vegetables passes into the eater. We receive it by eating the flesh of the animal. How much better to get it direct by eating the food that God provided for our use! – 1905

Posted by: Lancelot | July 11, 2008 03:04 PM

A short time ago i switched from vegetarian to vegan and i got two advantages: i don't need any animal products at all and i feel less heavy and more relaxed! The human being is not meant to eat meat and other animal products if he has the choice and GOD has nothing to do with any 'religion' because every religion claims to be the only true and saving one. GOD is beyond human understanding and not made in human image or vice versa! GOD is inconceivable and didn't dictate ancient books which have their source in human fantasy! So don't abuse GOD and you shall not abuse animals anymore and any living being!

Posted by: SHAWSHANK REDEMPTION | July 11, 2008 05:13 PM

Anyone who says an animal doesn't have a soul isn't paying much attention - if an animal can show compassion, love, sadness and joy, then who is anyone to say that they don't possess something as spiritual as well as soul, just as we do. I would never put any living creature above another, and assume that only we can carry a soul.

The point is whether we had a soul or not, every living creature has the right to live without pain and torture. I am very happy to hear the praises of the vegetarian lifestyle - those who condemn it are just too weak and embarrassed because they aren't changing their evil meat eating ways.

Posted by: Stray | July 11, 2008 05:34 PM

Kurt K

I agree with you : Catholics in general are not vegetarian/vegan and the CC focuses mostly on humans. As a fellow Catholic, I would like to introduce you to Catholic Concern for Animals, www.catholic-animals.org. I am a board member of CCA-USA; I encourage you to read the website. I know many Catholics that are vegan.
brandie r. insulted our respective faith a lot more if you read her comments carefully. Her comments sound both ignorant and offensive.

Peace.

Posted by: Ana | July 11, 2008 06:01 PM

I am a Christian and a vegan - but I definitely didn't learn about being a vegan from the Christian church. But now that I am a vegan, everything is so much deeper, more spiritual for me now. I not only think of "that poor cow" when I see someone scarfing down a cheeseburger.. but I think "God made that cow, so perfect, what right do *we* have to brutally torment, slaughter, sell, and *eat* him or her?"

God may have given "dominion" to man over the animals, but I believe it's much like the dominion he has over us - with love. We are to love the animals and take care of them - not factory farm them as machines!

God did give Noah permission to eat animals after the great flood - but this also represented a curse - as animals would no longer be our companions, they would fear us. Also, the earth had changed during the flood and all vegetitation had been destroyed. Without *some* meat, they would have starved. I do not, however, believe his intention was to have meat every single meal.. only if we would starve without it.

My husband was a catholic and was excommunicated when he married me (a protestant) - his parents are the most devout Catholics I know (also disowned him when he married me), and their "faith" wouldn't allow them to attend our wedding or have any part in our marriage. But they see nothing wrong with with eating meat - In fact, after we shared with them some of the horrors that go on in factory farms, my mother-in-law had the nerve to tell me that the chickens most likely felt no pain when their beaks were burned off - surely, it was much like having a hot needle stuck through a fingernail - What??

Posted by: Candi | July 11, 2008 06:14 PM

I am not religious at all though I do believe in God and I believe mostly in COMPASSION for other living things it is horriffic and barbaric the way animals are treated, transported and slaughtered! Though I do wonder why we naturally are meat eaters if it was not intended? and what about animals that kill and consume other animals? cats, dogs, fish all eat other animals, pigs will to if its available why is this? Though I do respect others beliefs I wonder how can you think animals have no soul they are caring, loving, intelligent, emotional creatures just like we are!..probably more caring than the majority of humans out there!

Posted by: Kelsi | July 11, 2008 07:13 PM

When God said "Thou shalt not kill," he didn't limit it to just humans. Otherwise, he would have said, "Thou shalt not kill just humans - feel free to eat anything else." There are Biblical references to support that this interpretation is true and also to support that God is "okay" with us killing animals and eating their meat. But as Christian who believes in the literal translation, I live Vegan. I encourage others who read the passage this way to do the same.

Posted by: Ana | July 12, 2008 09:25 AM

St. James, the Catholic Church here still has lamb and pig roasts on the lawn. Next weekend they are having a salmon roast. I guess no one there got the memo...

Posted by: Kelley | July 12, 2008 11:49 AM

As far as the question as to why God didn't make us all Vegans...God gave us free will, to do whatever we want. It is up to the individual to do what is right.

Posted by: Danielle | July 12, 2008 12:29 PM

Animals? No souls? I believe that the humans who torture and kill animals are the soulless ones.
John XXX111 wrote....
Man must never hurt animals. Must never ill treat them nor torture them physically because they are sensitive creatures. If anyone told me that to achieve my purpose it would be sufficient to kill an ant, I would not do it.

Posted by: Marilyn | July 12, 2008 03:04 PM

Hi...great discussion! I can't wait to add to it.

I grew up totally secular and became veg at 18. It wasn't until later I discovered a spirituality/religion that I really liked and fit my values, including vegetarianism.

The philosophy and yes, religion, is yoga...meaning having a "yoke with God" being at one with God.

Yoga, and other self-realization religions advocate vegetarianism for many reasons...some of which are:

*All animals have souls, do not want to be killed and we should respect their right to live
*Killing is bad for US, bad for our spiritual developement and degrades us
*Killing goes against all that is noble and good, namely compassion and mercy
*Animals are here to be our friends, we are in return supposed to respect and take care of them.
*Animals bring all kinds of spiritual blessings if we are good to them! We have no idea the blessings animals bring to us. If we did know this we would be sure to help them every chance we could get.
*Karma is part of all our lives...if we kill, we create negative karma. Not good for us...better to be veg!
*Eating meat is indirectly killing and very selfish because you are asking a poor person to kill so you can enjoy flesh. Not nice or compassionate or thoughtful...negative karmic effects especially if you know better.
*Killing creates a negative atmosphere in the air that effects us all. Killing adds darkness to our lives.
*If half of us were veg, there would be peace in the world...HALF. Our planet would be LUSH again.
*We were all given free will to choose good or bad. It's not that humans naturally love meat, it's an ingrained cultural habit, that is all. We can choose better. Once we know a better way, being the intelligent beings we are, we should choose that for our own evolution.
*Meat gets in the way of knowing the God within and meditation. It sullies our hearts/minds. We take on the fear and anger the animals felt while being killed...not good for inner peace.
*Yes, there are animals that eat meat and kill but that is their karma. As the Hari KRishnas say if a person loves meat and wants to eat meat in another life, they maybe born a cat! Remember, there are many vegetarian animals who are gentle and helpful to man...they are on a higher level.

One thing I love about yoga is they respect the core of all religions but definitely think most of them have been led astray away from the truth. The Christian denial of killing animals is one of them.

They believe all animals have souls...how can you say otherwise when looking in their eyes?

Kuyrt K: If animals were here for us to eat and part of God's plan, why do they protest being killed? Wouldn't God's plan be more harmonious and easy? If it isn't contrary to our soul nature to kill...why do we have to cover up slaughterhouses? Why do most of us feel disgust or horror at them. The reason is because the God within knows it is wrong.

Ask yourself...if we were naturally made to eat cows...wouldn't small children want to naturally kill them? We'd be hard pressed to take down a cow with our bodies only.

Candi... I think you have it right...eating meat creates fear between the aninmals and us and ruins the friendship and the beautiful planet we can create.

I don't believe you are living peace while eating meat at the same time. Your actions are contrary and contributing to the negative energy of killing which harms us all.

I am disappointed in many Seventh day aventists who do not adhere to their own teachings...we should point it out.

Blessings to you all.

Posted by: Soliel | July 12, 2008 03:29 PM

There seems to another Ana. I am the board member CCA Ana.

Peace!!!

Posted by: Ana | July 12, 2008 09:02 PM

God doesn't MAKE you a vegan, just like He doesn't make you a murderer or a rapist. We choose to be whatever we want to be. That is the lamest excuse I have ever heard from a meat eater.
And are you sure God MADE you and others "meat eaters"? I don't think so. Scholars strongly believe that Jesus was an ethical vegetarian.

Posted by: NT | July 12, 2008 09:52 PM

By the way, when I look into my animal friends' eyes I know they have souls. Besides, I believe Heaven is the happiest state of being and for us, animal lovers, heaven would not be heaven without our animals.

Posted by: NT | July 12, 2008 09:57 PM

funny, i go to a catholic school and nobody is like this. they all think global warming is a myth, aninals dont have souls or feel pain, that humans were meant to kill and animals were meant to be eaten. some even say things like "circuses treat their animals like kings" or "dairy farms are nice to cows" or "well maybe they just wait until the animal is already dead before they take the fur." i wish there were more people like this at my school- after all, what about "thou shall not kill?"

Posted by: claire | July 12, 2008 10:19 PM

I personally feel that it's not killing and eating an animal in itself that is wrong, it's the fact that: In the modern world, meat is not a life necessity, and today's companies place so much value on money that the animals are treated cruelly.

Many ancient cultures first had some sort of prayer to the animal or to God or their deity, giving thanks that God/nature provided NECESSARY (which they aren't today) materials and food, and then used every part of the animal, Today, animals are slaughtered and wasted unnecessarily, which is why I believe less meat should be eaten.

(Also, I have a question for vegans: How does milking a cow not taking care of a calf, or taking an UNfertilized, already laid egg from a chicken, provided the animals are properly cared for, harm them? I don't eat dairy or eggs because I am allergic, but I have always wondered.)

Posted by: Storm | July 12, 2008 11:02 PM

We're omnivores and always will be.

Posted by: Sue | July 13, 2008 04:09 AM

I am very pleased that PETA is directing efforts toward this demographic. And I was thrilled to know that those brochures that were mailed me "Vegetarianism and Christianity" were writted by a Catholic Priest. Yes, I did hand them out at the recent visit of the Pope to NYC. It was a pleasure and an honor. I was interviewed for an Italian newspaper and on camara with a Jesuit. The word is getting out there. This is a very important demographic, not just the Catholics, but the entire BODY OF CHRIST. OOOhhhh, God I LOVE you guys.

I Believe in the Goodness of all religions. The Bible says that there are many ministries with different purposes. Like the FRUIT of the Spirit and the Gifts of the Spirit. Different Gifts to different purposes under the sun. The Catholic Church is a very charitable organization that wields enormous influence and power over lots of people. Got a problem with the devil, go see the Pentacostals. Want to stop drinking, go see the Babtists, Need rigidity and control, join the Jehovah's Wetnesses.

Problem is most rarely (with the exception of the Pentacostals) ever even address the devil, as if ignoring the devil will make that "evil genious" go away. Satan is/was the Archangel of Warship and is alive and well on planet earth and in the Church. The devil (the father of lies) has lied to us and has our attention, our focus misdirected. Don't kid yourselves folks, Genisis 1:29 tells us what "GOD" gave us to eat.

Posted by: Saucy | July 13, 2008 12:53 PM

Great post, great article, and great dialogue going on here. I'm vegan, and Catholic. I believe that creation was first vegetarian, and that after the fall, almost in a concession to the sin that had come into the world, God did allow the eating of animals. That said, I think Christians are called to work toward redeeming creation, with God. I think that's part of humanity's vocation, a responsibiliity that accompanies the rights we are granted in dominion. In the US, where probably 95% or more farmed animals are cruelly raised and killed in large, corporate (e.g. neglectful and quick-line-speed) settings, buying and eating flesh is--based only on my sense of faith--not part of redeeming creation. Again, though, only my thoughts ...

Posted by: Dean Ween | July 13, 2008 01:10 PM

ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE...
(FOR THOSE WHO BELIEVE)...

IN THE BEGINNING - THE GARDEN OF EDEN WAS VEGAN...

THIS WAS GOD's ORIGINAL PURPOSE FOR MANKIND:

Genesis Chapter 1:
1:29 Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food." And it was so.

IN THE END, THE FINAL KINGDOM WILL AGAIN BE VEGETARIAN:

ACCORDING TO ISAIAH, NO LIVING BEING (HUMAN OR ANIMAL) WILL KILL ANOTHER:

Isaiah Chapter 11:
6 The wolf will live with the lamb, the leopard will lie down with the goat, the calf and the lion and the yearling [a] together; and a little child will lead them.
7 The cow will feed with the bear, their young will lie down together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox.
8 The infant will play near the hole of the cobra, and the young child put his hand into the viper's nest.
9 They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, for the earth will be full of the knowledge of the LORD as the waters cover the sea.

NO MATTER WHICH WAY - THE BEGINNING AND ORIGINAL PURPOSE FOR US - OR THE END AND THE FINAL KINGDOM -

THE EARTH WILL AGAIN BE VEG

AND ANY BELIEVER IN THE BIBLE SHOULD NOT KILL AND EAT ANIMALS BECAUSE THAT CONTRADICTS BOTH THE BEGINNING AND THE END

Posted by: Lancelot | July 13, 2008 03:34 PM

Right, so we have free will and everything, given to us by God. With it we should do what's right -- taking advantage of other options is the right thing. If we have the ability to not only survive but thrive without harming animals, shouldn't we take advantage of it? At this point, it's just brutal and unnecessary. We have so many other options; killing and eating helpless animals shouldn't be one.

Posted by: Cait | July 13, 2008 08:04 PM

I am a Catholic and a vegetarian. My mother and some of my Catholic friends tell me that it is okay to eat animals, because they don't have souls. I don't care whether or not they have souls (which I believe they do), but my being a vegetarian is about the cruelty to animals and the health benefits of not eating meat. I also think that it is wrong that tons grain and water go to feed livestock, when it could go to feed the starving people. They would actually get some use out of it. I posted the article to some of my friends, hoping they will read it and realize that I'm not the only Catholic vegetarian. I'm glad that somebody who is Catholic is sticking up and speaking out for animals.

Posted by: Randi | July 13, 2008 11:17 PM

I seriously don't get you people. Since all of a sudden there is such a thing as a human. Have you looked in books or online at least. We are all animals. And who are we to judge who has a soul or not.

Posted by: Tajana | July 14, 2008 03:41 AM

I'm not religious, but I belive that is you aren't prepared to go and kill and gut the animal yourself, then you shouldn't eat it.
I think it is pathetic when people happily scarf down hamburgers, but if you mention what that animal has gone through, they yell at you to stop talking because it's " so horrible" IF THEY THINK IT IS HORRIBLE, WHY DO THEY EAT IT? It is part of the food chain to eat other animals as well as plants, if you don't want to eat the animals, thats fine too.
It also bugs me when vegatains and vegans won't eat meat because it is cruel to the animal, but if there is a spider or a fly, they squish it. If it isn't o.k to take an animals life to eat it, why is it o.k to take ones life so it stops annoying you?
p.s sorry if I offended anyone!

Posted by: Rose | July 14, 2008 04:56 AM

Somebody mentioned that they "have yet to hear about any religion that preaches against eating meat."

As far as religion and vegetarianism goes, Buddhism, Hinduism, and Jainism all advocated a vegetarian diet. Although Jainism (a religion in which all life is considered worthy of respect, advocating protection to even the smallest of creatures) is the only religion that REQUIRES its monks and laity, from all its sects and traditions, to be vegetarian. Food, which contains even small particles of the bodies of dead animals or eggs, is absolutely unacceptable.

Jains believe that all living things have a soul, and they go out of their way to not hurt even small insects and other tiny animals because they are convinced that harm caused by carelessness is as reprehensible as harm caused by deliberate action. Hence they take great pains to make sure that no minuscule animals are injured by the preparation of their meals and in the process of eating and drinking.

Jains also make considerable efforts not to injure plants in everyday life as far as possible. They admit that plants must be destroyed for the sake of food, but they only accept such violence inasmuch as it is indispensable for human survival, and there are special instructions for preventing unnecessary violence against plants. Some Jains don’t eat plants and plant parts that grow underground, such as potatoes, onions, roots and tubers, because tiny life forms are injured when the plant is pulled up and because the bulb is seen as a living being, as it is able to sprout.

This has been a public service announcement brought to you by Peri.

Posted by: Peri | July 14, 2008 06:08 AM

I am a Pagan, and we are taught to have respect for every living thing, and that every living thing has a soul. I have always believed that, and even when I ate meat, I never ate that much.

No matter what religion you believe, or what god or gods you do (or don't) believe in, I think compassion for others, including animals, is something we all need to practice. In a world where war and death dominates the news at 9, why not make the news for doing something to change the fate of the people and the animals they depend on around you?

Most people in the world don't see the videos or the cruelty that people on this site have seen. Most people also get desensitized to the violence because we've been shown on TV and other media outlets that animals are ours to do with as we wish.

How about we start local vegetarian groups, meeting places where others with our views can come and decide on peaceful ways to spread the message?

I'm honestly not one for showing the pictures of suffering animals, mainly because it makes me sick to see them. However, I direct people to this site and tell them to explore it, or just try to be vegetarian for a month, or even a week.

Since becoming vegetarian, I've lost a ton of weight, I feel more energized, and I can feel good about what I'm doing to help the animals and the environment. The people at my work are also noticing it, and so far two people have joined me in becoming vegetarian. Leading by example is a fantastic way to spread the message.

We need more articles like the one posted in the Catholic journal to encourage people to consider an alternative to meat. Consider writing a compassionate letter to the editor of your local paper, or ask if you could do an article on local vegetarian options. The more we spread the word, the less suffering we have to witness. As I believe Stella McCartney (can't remember who) once said, "If slaughterhouses had glass walls, we'd all be vegetarians."

Posted by: Irene | July 14, 2008 10:32 AM

The Catholics didn't say anything. A catholic, who also writes for PETA, said everyone should be vegetarians. PETA shouldn't give the entire catholic church so much credit. The catholic church's attitude is by in large in need of updating. Any church that preaches continued unchecked human reproduction in the face of starvation and overpopulation has issues. Historically, religions that do not evolve along with humanity are doomed to die out. Catholicism, as well as the other primitive religions, by the numbers at least, seem to be headed to their doom. By some accounts, atheist or agnostics have risen to nearly 70% in some European countries. America lags behind as we often do in social issues, as PETA often points out.

Posted by: Christopher Cochran MD | July 14, 2008 10:33 AM

Christopher,
I will disagree with you on this one. Catholocism is still a very strong entity in the world. Wherever the Pope goes all people, Catholic or not turn out by the thousands to see him. I believe most peopel want to be closer to God, but in this day and age life is so fast that it is hard for people to find the time.
The reason Europe is losing the faith is because it is a highly liberal/socialist place where the gap between chuch and state is so wide the Christian values are being forgotten.
Our government, though formed under separtating chuch and state, was still created with a heavy christian influence.
I do agree with you though that Catholics as group, don't buy into the Vegan lifestyle. I hate when people misquote or take one passage out of the Bible and make it seem that Jesus was one way or another.
I respect my fellow man, I am kind and caring to my family and I try to treat people the best way I know how. This is what I believe God wants from us all. I believe we are seperate from animals in God's plan. After all, we were created in his image and his only son was a man, not an animal.
That is what I believe, I guess I will find out one day if I am wrong!

Posted by: Kurt K | July 14, 2008 12:20 PM

I do not disagree that catholicism is still prevalent. The fact remains, christianity, in it's present form, is dying a slow death. The numbers in Europe and here in the US play that out. The inevitable encroachment of science and knowledge has deeply eroded the superstitions of an ancient way of thought. Modern christians, in an effort to come to terms with new knowledge (like the earth really is older than 6,000 years) try to reinterpret the fairy tale with, "well maybe a day to God is like a billion of our years." In fact, many are simply abandoning the whole hoax all together. I would contend that people have plenty of time to be religious, they just don't need it anymore. Religion answers fewer and fewer questions for modern peoples.

Posted by: Christopher Cochran MD | July 14, 2008 01:46 PM

Perhaps! You have made some really great points. I have made the statement to my friends and family that it was much easier to believe in God 50 years ago. Today we have contend with all the "evidence" and theories that make it hard to believe.
I guess that is why faith is so important to christians. The physical world has boundries and limitations but the spiritual world has none. To me God is to complex to fully understand what he is in our current conditions. I would rather have faith in something beautiful than believe in nothing at all!

Posted by: Kurt K | July 14, 2008 04:12 PM

I am not religious, but I think any beliefs linked to God must be sensible about the animal cruelty.If there aren`t religions that love animals and like vegans,so they can`t say the truth about God.Unfortunately,every one are falses...

Posted by: jackie | July 15, 2008 11:57 AM

Kurt K, posted July 14, 2008 04:12 PM Good point, I agree!

Posted by: Carla | July 15, 2008 12:20 PM

If your non-religious I will not shove my religion down your throat. We all must walk our own paths!

Posted by: Kurt K | July 15, 2008 12:38 PM

Christianity will never die out until the full onslaught of the anti-christ.

However Doc, you do make some valid points. I, for one, (this modern day Christian) am aware that the earth is much, much older than 6000 years. Thats rediculous. Also there are civilizations that pre-date Adam and Eve.

The Miracle of God is Mystical and Spiritual not logical Doc. Your on this post for a reason and I encourage you to explore and open your heart to the Love of God.

The churches for all of their goodness and faith are in Error. It's true. And anyone who believes everything they read in the text of the Bible is just plain foolish. The Bible itself expains in the forward that it is MARRED WITH MISTAKES AND HAS GRAVE ERRORS. What I find to be, quite frankly, dangerous is the modern Bibles that are being sold today, that forward has been deleted. That is not good folks.

Posted by: Saucy | July 15, 2008 01:41 PM

Pastafarian

Go Vegan...

Posted by: :) | July 15, 2008 05:13 PM

My decision to be a vegetarian has nothing to do with religion (as an athiest). It is biologically unnatural for humans not to eat meat, but I think we have a responsibility to be kind to animals because they don't deserve to be treated poorly. I know that I wouldn't want to be raised for the purpose of being slaughtered and eaten by another species! God or no god, religion or no religion. It's secular ethics to be compassionate.

Posted by: Leah | July 15, 2008 08:49 PM

The concept of a 'soul' is a human construct from Latin-anima (what animates) and Gk- psyche (breath)-something all life has. The Church borrowed the concept from the ancients and in their hands it became something only humans possess.

Posted by: lynda downie | July 15, 2008 10:07 PM

Christopher C
I agree, great posts.

Posted by: lynda downie | July 15, 2008 10:09 PM

Thanks Carla! I appreciate that. Have a great week!

Posted by: Kurt K | July 16, 2008 12:06 PM

Irene,

Hey, I'm a Pagan too - you're the first one I've met here!!

I wish all religions would speak more openly to each other.

I strongly beleive that we all have different religions, but they all have a common purpouse:

The one unifying purpouse of religion is to motivate people to behave in an ethical manner.

That way our communities are safer, happier and healthier. This includes treating all animals with respect.

Posted by: Maya, CVT | July 16, 2008 12:37 PM

A Vegan Pagan's Prayer
Lord of the forest and field, Lady of the starlit night,
I acknowledge the truth that for me to live, something must die.
I give thanks for the gift of free will,
And I acknowledge the responsibility that comes with the freedom of choice.

I choose then to abstain from the cycle of unnecessary suffering.
I pledge to be an agent of healing, not a bystander to slaughter.
I say to the animals:
You do not have to suffer and die for me.
I say to the workers:
You do not have to kill for me.
I say to the corporate death machine:
You will no longer profit from my blindness.
I say to the Earth, and to all that is holy,
That though we are taught to feast upon war,
I choose to lay down the sword
And take in peace instead.
I ally myself with Nature, not as her master, but as her child.
I will not claim dominion over that which is wiser than I.

Lord of the forest and field, Lady of the starlit night,
May compassion fulfill and transform me
May I give as You give, may I love as You love
And may my choices bring grace to my life
As You bring grace to the world.

So mote it be.

Posted by: Holly | July 16, 2008 04:58 PM

Aha, the good Dr. Breen I see,

There is nothing cynical about it this prayer.

This prayer is truth, purity and goodness for all, and a standard of life to live by.

I hope we all can live by it, all the days of our lives.

Let us all live a peaceful life and do no harm.

Go Vegan.

Posted by: Holly | July 17, 2008 10:35 AM

Thank you, Holly!! That was lovely! ;)

Posted by: Maya, CVT | July 17, 2008 10:48 AM

Holly,
I am not trying to be disrepectful, but I have a question about the prayer. It is a nice prayer don't get me wrong. But is this a contradiction?

"I acknowledge the truth that for me to live, something must die."

And then:

"I say to the animals:
You do not have to suffer and die for me."

I just thought that was strange. Again, I am not trying to be disrespectful.

Posted by: Kurt K | July 17, 2008 11:14 AM

In case some of you didn't know the Catholic beliefs in a nut shell!

"We believe in one God,
the Father, the Almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all that is, seen and unseen.
We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God,
eternally begotten of the Father,
God from God, Light from Light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made,
of one Being with the Father.
Through him all things were made.
For us and for our salvation
he came down from heaven:
by the power of the Holy Spirit
he became incarnate from the Virgin Mary,
and was made man.
For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate;
he suffered death and was buried.
On the third day he rose again
in accordance with the Scriptures;
he ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,
and his kingdom will have no end.

We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father and the Son.
With the Father and the Son he is worshiped and glorified.
He has spoken through the Prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look for the resurrection of the dead,
and the life of the world to come. Amen."

That about sums it up! But not really.

Posted by: Kurt K | July 17, 2008 11:21 AM

Hey Kurt! I have not had a chance to chat, buddy!

I hope Holly doesn't mind if I respond - I think the statements are seperate.

In other words, the first statement means that all humans impact the Earth. For example, every time I eat a plant, it must be ripped out of the soil and die.

So it does not necessarily mean an animal must die. However, the simple act of using a paved road or mall means that habitat was destroyed, and dozens of animals may have died that way.

It's always good to acknowldedge that even I as a vegetarian will inevitable cause the death of many by my lifestyle.

But saying to the animals, you don't have to suffer and die for me, means that we do not ever assume that we have the right to kill an animal for our selfish needs.

Love ya, buddy. And thanks for letting me speak on Paganism.

Again, Holly, lovely poem!

Posted by: Maya, CVT | July 17, 2008 12:07 PM

Kurt,
A tree dies so I can have a house. I step on a small insect not knowing it was there... its like that...
most important is to try to do no harm...or as little harm as possible.

The Apostles and Nicene creeds are beautiful...

Also followed by the Episcopal Church.
and the Anglican Episcopal Church, and
Anglican Church of England...

It is the book of common prayer they follow also and many have given up their lives for those very words in the creeds.

Faith is very strong in so many...

Posted by: Holly | July 17, 2008 02:09 PM

Thank You Maya,
I dont know who wrote it, it was sent to me a while back and I liked it so much I kept it.

It is a prayer that should be shared, I think.

Everyone enjoy this midsummer day, and peace to all.

Go vegan...

Posted by: Holly | July 18, 2008 07:09 AM

I kinda figured that is what your prayer was getting at.
It is a lovely prayer and thanks for the responses Maya and Holly. Its more fun to talk calmly and constructively about things instead of name calling and insults. I hope we can keep this trend going!
Talk to you soon,

Kurt

Posted by: Kurt K | July 18, 2008 09:01 AM

Hello Storm,
You ask very good questions.
When a calf is born on a milking farm, the calf is taken away from its mother shortly after birth, so the mother can be milked and her milk can be sold for humans to drink. Not enough to share!

I grow up on a dairy farm and have heard those mother cows cry for their babies and the baby's cry for their mothers.

If the baby is a girl, she is will grow up to be a milker her self, and she will have her baby's taken away so humans can drink her milk.

Now if the baby is a boy,he is taken away from his mother and he penned up in a small area where he cant get much exercise. he is fed a diet that makes him anemic so his meat will be nice and pale and tender for he will become a veal calf, and will be sent to slaughter when he is very young so he can be eatten by humans who enjoy eating baby calf flesh.

Now the milking cow will give birth many times in her life time and have her baby's taken away each and every time and she is milked until she can no longer give enough milk, and then she is sent to slaughter and becomes hamburger because her flesh is not so tender after all the birthing and milking she wont become a steak not tender enough...
Often fast food places buy milking cow hamburger, it is cheaper...you know McDonald's, Burger King etc...

The more humans demand milk, the more baby calves die.
Humans are drinking the cows baby's milk.
As a woman, I cant stand to think of some one taking a new born away from a mother who wants her baby, and a baby that wants its mother...this is so tragic... and sad...

The chicken egg is another post...

Got to go now..

Go Vegan, save up to 100 farm animals per year.

Don't let your body become a graveyard for animals...

Hope this helps...

Keith, yes civil is the best way to talk...
Maya nice to see you again...

Have a great Midsummer weekend everyone!

Posted by: Holly | July 18, 2008 08:36 PM